Unlabelled Destiny - [D2] Daily Reset Thread [2018-03-29]

3/30/2018 04:17:00 am
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Destiny - [D2] Daily Reset Thread [2018-03-29]

[D2] Daily Reset Thread [2018-03-29]

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 10:05 AM PDT

Daily Milestone

none / bugged?

Planetary Challenges

Planet Challenge 1 Challenge 2 Challenge 3
EDZ Lost Sectors: Firebase Hades - Loot a Lost Sector near Firebase Hades. Red Legion Raider - Loot 3 Cabal supply caches. Scourge of the Fallen - Defeat 75 Fallen enemies.
Titan Lost Sectors: The Rig - Loot a Lost Sector in the Rig. Event Horizon - Successfully complete a public event. Scourge of the Hive - Defeat 75 Hive enemies.
Nessus Lost Sectors: The Tangle - Loot a Lost Sector in the Tangle. Event Horizon - Succesfully complete a public event. Scourge of the Fallen - Defeat 75 Fallen enemies.
IO Pyramidion Raider - Defeat 40 enemies around the entrance to the Vex Pyramidion. Event Horizon - Successfully complete a public event. Cut Off One Head - Defeat a Vex Hydra.
Mercury Lost and Found - *Complete a Lost Sector. Vex Treasures - Loot 3 Vex treasure chests. Dead Legion - Kill 75 Cabal.

Strike Challenges

Challenge 1 Challenge 2 Challenge 3 Titan Challenge 3 Hunter Challenge 3 Warlock
Point Blank - Defeat 20 enemies with precision attacks at close range. Null and Void - As a fireteam, defeat 100 enemies using Void attacks. Ricochet - As a Sentinel, defeat multiple enemies by throwing your shield, 5 times. Concealment - As a Nightstalker, defeat 10 enemies blinded by your smoke grenade. Devouring Void - As a Voidwalker, defeat an enemy using Bloom.

Heroic Strike Challenges

Challenge 1 Challenge 2 Challenge 3 Titan Challenge 3 Hunter Challenge 3 Warlock
Cycle of Light - Create 10 orbs for your allies. Null and Void - As a fireteam, defeat 100 enemies using Void attacks. Ricochet - As a Sentinel, defeat multiple enemies by throwing your shield, 5 times. Concealment - As a Nightstalker, defeat 10 enemies blinded by your smoke grenade. Devouring Void - As a Voidwalker, defeat an enemy using Bloom.

Crucible Challenges

Mode Challenge 1 Challenge 2 Challenge 3
Quickplay High Voltage - Defeat 15 opponents with Arc final blows. Shutdown Artist - Defeat an opponent while their Super is active. Deadeye - Defeat 10 opponents with Precision final blows.
Osiris Quickplay The Hunger - Defeat 15 opponents with Void final blows. Shutdown Artist - Defeat an opponent while their Super is active. Blaze of Glory - Defeat 5 opponents using your Supers.
Competitive Sound And Fury - As a team, defeat 20 opponents using Supers. On A Roll - Win back-to-back rounds 3 times. Shoot the Glowing One - As a team, defeat 5 opponents while their Supers are active.
Osiris Competitive Rocket Beats Everything - As a team, defeat 20 opponents using Power weapons. On A Roll - Win back-to-back rounds 3 times. Deny Their Supply - As a team, load Power ammo 3 times before the opposing team loads any.
Mayhem Child of the Sun - Defeat 15 opponents with Solar final blows. Payback - Defeat 5 opponents who recently defeated you or a teammate. Look Them in the Eye - Defeat 10 opponents at close range.
Trials of Osiris Tribute - As a fireteam, defeat 150 opponents. Fulfillment - Win 10 rounds. Judgment - Win 5 matches.

Heroic Adventure Modifiers

  • Attrition: Health and shield regeneration slow down, but killing foes may create wells of Light that restore health and charge your Super.
  • Elementalist: Energy weapon damage increased. Grenades deal more damage and recharge faster. Melee damage decreased.

Vendors

Gunsmith:

  • Head Impact Absorption Mod
  • Arms Energy Counterbalance Mod
  • Void Damage Mod

Data provided by DestinyTracker

submitted by /u/DTG_Bot
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If we're dissatisfied with the state of the game, maybe we should stop playing for now.

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 07:22 AM PDT

If we haven't noticed before as a community, you really ought to have noticed by now - they're not talking with us, they're talking at us. Who can blame them?

Those who complain still actively play the game. How can the game be as bad as they say if they still play it? How can Destiny 2 still be popular enough for people to be so energized about it? (Look at this subreddit's activity vs other gaming subreddits; outside of Overwatch/LoL, very few gaming subreddits are as active).

How seriously would you take someone complaining about your cooking but constantly devouring it?

Some food for thought.

submitted by /u/luna_minnus
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Dear Bungie, in the next TWAB please tell us what you think we want

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 03:42 AM PDT

I just want to see a list of the most requested changes to the game, with developer commentary. I do not care about what is possible to implement and what isn't. I want proof that you know what the majority of us WANT and what your stance on those ideas are.

It still feels like we're banging our heads against a wall at times. The latest update was alright, but somehow feels like a way to address the issues Destiny 2 has, without actually attempting to fix them.

submitted by /u/JaccoStoete
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[Rant] When is Bungie finally going to realize that Destiny is in crisis, and they need to take it seriously?

Posted: 28 Mar 2018 07:57 PM PDT

So far, Bungie's ambiguous responses have been made mostly by CMs, and those are usually some variant of "I'll need to speak to my manager." The sparse communications from actual developers have been outstanding efforts in creative and innovative ways to make old and long-standing disappointment feel like fresh and renewed disappointment.

 

It's not going to cut it for much longer. Bungie developers may complain all they want about their dissatisfied customers, but as evidenced by the most salient of Destiny fans, the streamer community, "dissatisfied" is quickly turning into "bored and uninterested." In this case, the opposite of "satisfied" isn't "toxic": it's the future absence of paying customers.

 

Literally thousands of threads have been made on this and other media, with well-reasoned and explained suggestions for improvement, including meticulously researched facts and data. So much so that more discussion has probably been made on this sub alone than in all of Bungie, and certainly much more than their standard responses to even the most stunningly sensical and useful suggestions: "We'll look into it," "We're listening," or "We hear you."

 

Sorry, but no-one is that easily satisfied or impressed, with the possible exception of some hiring managers at Bungie.

 

Here's the problem: Bungie clearly does not hear us. Every single communication from Bungie's employees further confirms the well-established fact that the developers are in a self-sustaining feedback bubble.

 

They look at their past successes and the initial sales figures for D2 and smile to themselves, brushing off the overwhelmingly negative feedback from their customers as that of a vocal, ignorant minority and go on imagining themselves to be master pâtissiers, acting as if the smallest tuning of a pretend shotgun (likely via changing numbers in a text file) were a supreme effort, imagining themselves as producing perfect croquembouche or soufflés, when the actual product is burnt Wonderbread toast, and it takes nine months, two DLCs and 40,000 begging and pleading suggestions for Bungie to figure out how to butter it on the side facing up.

 

Please don't tell me to get excited about a "sandbox update" or an "exotic pass." The mere fact that terms like these are so ubiquitous in the community now just shows the extent to which the game is broken. The fact that it takes Bungie six to eight months to deliver these band-aids indicates how incapable they seem to be of fixing it.

 

Bungie has, by some accounts, nearly 1,000 employees. Surely some of those must be developers and engineers, and surely they can discover a method for the bulk deletion of shaders faster than it takes two humans to court, copulate, gestate, and give live birth, with or without romance. The best of Bungie's actual accomplishments since Destiny 2's release have been half-hearted efforts at restoring anemic versions of features better implemented in the past. Their increasingly slippery road maps to improvement have all the feigned earnestness and reliability of a freshly shaved, alcoholic divorcée's half-hearted promises to their continually disappointed and increasingly estranged children.

 

"But it's a major issue that will take a massive effort to solve!" They say? (How many times have we heard that, and for how many problems?) Well, then show us a massive effort. What we've seen so far feels far from that, and it's clearly not working.

 

So fix it. Above all:

 

+Fix the fucking weapon categories. Take the Bungie employee immediately above whoever should have slapped the person who thought two primaries was an idea outside, help them fill out an application to work as a whale flenser, then give the other two employees jobs at the White House.

 

+Decrease the TTK. If you happen to be employed by Bungie at the moment, let me rephrase: DECREASE THE FUCKING TTK. That is what Destiny players have asked for literally thousands of times, and that is what you need to do. Please do not "blue curtain" this, and do not "Go-Faster" this by again overestimating your literacy or underestimating ours. Please don't misinterpret "Decrease TTK" to mean that Destiny players really want a roast-beef milkshake, an inflatable ass paddle, involuntary organ donations, or something truly absurd such as a speed increase that doesn't actually increase sprint speed (It boggles the mind! A "go faster" update that completely overlooks the primary action one normally takes to "go faster"?)

 

So please don't pull out your English-to-Non-Sequiter dictionaries, Tarot cards, Ouija boards, divining rods, chicken bones, Fox News commentators or whatever it is you've used to botch basic reading comprehension so far, lock the handful of developers you have who believe they know what Destiny players want more than the entire community does in a closet somewhere, stop listening to the opinions of "sandbox team" members who have to erect a wall of blocked Twitter accounts trying to give helpful critical feedback on the game to better hear the six sycophants who apparently believe that turning the Crucible into Soggy Nerf Pickleball for Mouth Breathers has been a fine idea, and fucking listen for once:

 

When the entire community begs and pleads for six months that you decrease TTK, maybe you should just decrease the fucking time to kill.

 

(As in, reduce the number of shots required to kill a player, make primaries more powerful, increase primary weapon damage, have players take more damage when shot with a primary weapon, reduce the number of primary weapon shots a player can survive, boost primary weapon damage, make primary weapons hit harder and kill quicker, or however you need it phrased to understand the point.)

 

Here's the rest:

PvE: +Decrease ability cooldown, diversify and differentiate class and subclass roles and abilities +Deliver two full raids each year with more than one boss encounter each. +More cohesive and internally consistent narrative and lore, with a return to D1's complexity, quality, adrenaline, and tone. (Less 4panelcringe and more Black Mirror meets Pacific Rim, please.) +Implement either a Diablo-esque loot system, or a MHW-esque crafting system +Return innovative, creative weapon and armor perks benefiting the relevant activities in which they are dropped (i.e. raid/crucible perks) +Make exotics feel exotic again (originally, they were intended to be "game-changing," now the only thing they change is how long I have to hold down the button to shard them) +Less obviously exploitative microtransactions +In-game, the100-style lfg including Sherpa rewards as well as actual text and voice chat, esp. in social spaces

 

PvP: +Update to minimum current standards (dedicated servers, 60fps, etc.) +Diversify and differentiate class- and subclass roles and abilities +6v6 (or greater) teams +Larger and more diverse map types and game modes. +Selectable game types and more objective-based game types

 

Did I mention: Decrease TTK? Thanks for reading, and best of luck to us all.

 

Edit: Thanks for the metric ass-ton of gold, and one day I hope to post equally enthusiastic praise about all the improvements to Destiny that haven't happened yet. Bungie, please make that happen.

submitted by /u/maesterf
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Nightfall loot is well and truly disappointing

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 07:58 AM PDT

We were told that Nightfall specific loot was held off for an extra month so that the Artists had more time to create something that looked special

This lead me and the majority of the community to believe that FINALLY we'd get really badass enemy inspired armour and weapons

We got 3 Guns. 2 Sparrows. 1 Ghost. 1 re-skinned ship (don't dare tell me otherwise it absolutely is).

Bungie, we don't want Ghosts, Sparrows and Ships. Seriously. Just....just, c'mon now.

Edit: We don't want Ghosts, Sparrows and Ships from a challenging Nightfall. I appreciate you've been hounded during the first few months of the game for not giving us them but we have ample opportunities to gain them now from Eververse and events like Iron Banner and Crimson Days playlist.

submitted by /u/Tbeeb
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I know why Bungie is being so slow with delivering updates...

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 11:47 AM PDT

They want us to have enough time to delete shaders to make space for new stuff. Thanks Bungo <3

submitted by /u/iamgroot91
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I'd like to see "Bungie replied" at more posts about Time to Kill and Weapon Slots

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 03:57 AM PDT

I know they are aware but it would be great for people to really know that they know sounded like Phoebe we all (at least 90%) want TTK and weapon slots back to D1 standards.

submitted by /u/just_SiLeNtWaLkEr
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My Dad’s thoughts on the troubles with D2

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 10:05 AM PDT

So I had dinner with my father last night and I was going through the laundry lists of complaints that we all have. I gave him background context for how things used to be in D1, and how they changed TTK, the loot system, the loadout system, etc. And I just thought that it was funny that he heard all of these things and asked pretty much the same questions that we all ask as a community on a daily basis as to how we could have possibly gotten to this point.

 

Regarding the loot system: "Seems to me the old way was like a slot machine, and the new way is like getting a birthday card. Getting money in a birthday card is nice, but you know you are going to get it and you get it every year and it's generally the same amount. You open the card, smile, and put the money in your wallet, done. But when you win money from a slot machine, even if it's less than what you get in your birthday card, it's still way more exciting because it's random."

 

Regarding TTK: "So their solution to you guys asking for a lower time to kill is to make you go faster? Seems to me that will just make people even harder to kill" (this is when I told him about them adding more power ammo) "So then they are trying to indirectly solve the issue? Sounds like poor management"

 

Regarding loot perks being stale: "So you used to have two perks on a gun, and now you only have one? Why would they retract? If you have something that works, you expand on it, you don't water it down. Think of any restaurant that gets bought by a new owner and they try to cut costs to make more profit, what happens? They close within a year because they took something the customer knew and loved and made it worse due to using cheaper ingredients. It never works out."

 

Regarding the weapon system: "So your choice is between a sniper rifle, a shotgun and a rocket launcher? Who in their right mind is picking anything other than a Rocket Launcher?" Granted, he's not aware of the Acrius, so he's not fully informed, but I still found it funny.

 

On Super/Ability regen: "That's just silly, why would they want you to be less powerful?" (at this point I informed him of all the ability spam complaints from D1 PVP) "So then just make them come up less often when you are playing people, but faster when you are fighting against the alien things, can't they do that?"

 

In closing, I just find it amusing that my 70 year old father, who's last game he put any serious time into was Dr. Mario, can see these problems and have pretty much the same view point as us, despite never having ever even seen the game, much less play it. I wish I had recorded the whole conversation, but here were his closing thoughts: "It seems to me like they had something good going with the first game and they should have just expanded on that. But instead they tried to reinvent the wheel so that they could sell more copies of the sequel. Now I don't know games, but I know business, and that business model never works. If you have something great, you try to find a way to make is better, not simpler. You should use your customer feedback to do so. Otherwise you are just making something based off what you want, which could be great, but more often than not, it will just be great to you, not your customers. And you always, ALWAYS, listen to your most loyal customers first. You keep your loyal customers happy, and they will in turn bring you new customers by telling their friends how good the product is."

submitted by /u/spanman112
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Bungie Plz Addition: Lower Primary / Energy Weapon Time to Kill in PVP

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 05:15 AM PDT

Howdy Guardians,

This change has been added to Bungie Plz.
Going forward, all posts suggesting this change will be removed and redirected to this Megathread.

Submitted by: /u/pencilshoes

Date approved: 2018-03-28

Modmail Discussion:

/u/pencilshoes

Why it should be added:

The current primary weapon TTK is entirely too slow. It encourages a teamshot meta, which stifles individual players and imbalances towards 4-stack Fireteams. It reduces the skill gap, frustrating your most dedicated players and hinders individual skill progression. Lastly, it forces a dependence on the Power ammo economy, as our Kinetic/Energy weapons cannot conceivably counter those launchers or shotguns. Aim for an average TTK of ~0.85s, with lower skill weapons (ARs) on the higher end of that scale and higher skill weapons (HCs, SMGs) on the lower end of that scale. The current optimal TTK of >1.0s is more frustrating than fun.

After 1.1.4, Vigilance Wing appears to be in a decent place for the community, though it's optimal TTK of ~0.83s requires all head shots (the highest of skill tier). Based on these example posts, the above-average skill tier should have a TTK around the 0.85s mark, with the highest tier rewarded with a slightly lower TTK than that.

u/RiseOfBacon

Hey! Thanks for the submission.

After review, not all of your links meet the Spec but there are still enough to induct 'Lowering Primary / Energy TTK' into Bungie Plz

Thanks! We'll get this made up and posted later today

Cheers

Examples given: Example 1, Example 2, Example 3, Bonus Example 4 & Bonus Example 5

Criteria Used:

"...3 examples (with links) of recent submissions (with at least 1 being over 5 days old), that have been well received (hundreds of upvotes on the front page of the sub - ex. 300+ upvotes)."

submitted by /u/DTG_Bot
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So the “Go Fast Update” completely ignored our primary method of movement (sprinting) and barely increased walk speed. Bungie is legitimately trolling us at this point...

Posted: 28 Mar 2018 09:41 PM PDT

They hyped this update up so much!

They even did a dev commentary YouTube vid and the dude was like "we're excited to see the crazy new plays that will happen in the crucible".

Crazy new plays from what? 5% increase to walk speed? 10% increase to Arcstrider and Sentinel speed? I don't know whether to be upset or laugh my ass off...

Over promised and under delivered as usual. 😩

submitted by /u/Chaoxytal
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Massive Breakdown of One Potential Way to Balance Primary and Special Weapons Around a Faster Time-to-Kill (0.67s to 1.00s)

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 12:39 PM PDT

For those who just want to see the Time-to-Kill Balance chart (now with fancy color coding!)

Note: Please keep in mind this is clearly a fantasy project, where we have the ability to change anything and everything in the Destiny sandbox. Yes, there would have to be some other changes made in order to accommodate this scenario. The chart given was only meant to show the balance between Times-to-Kill, and not things like aerial accuracy and perk effectiveness. That is for a later date. This is in no way supposed to represent the perfect meta. Some weapons would be too good, some weapons would be too weak. It's just my attempt to show my idea of what a mostly balanced sandbox would look like with a universal decrease in time-to-kill.

In order to strike a balance between weapons that kill more quickly and those that kill slowly, I tried to abide by a couple of basic principles:

  1. Weapons that have shorter effective range should, in general, kill slightly faster than weapons with longer effective range. This is because high skill players can use long range weapons with high zoom in close distances, but low zoom weapons cannot be used at long range due to damage and aim assist fall off.
  2. Weapons that kill very quickly (0.60s to 0.80s, in general) need to be limited by something, otherwise they quickly become OP. There are two potential methods to limit their use:
    • Make them very difficult to use. This is done by requiring a very high percentage of critical hits in order to achieve the Optimal TtK. Indeed, you can see that some of the most powerful weapons in terms of kill time (High-Impact SRs and PRs, Precision HCs, SUROS and Omolon SAs) all require 100% critical hits in order to get their optimal TtKs. If you miss one single shot, the TtK often drops off dramatically, making them the definition of high risk high reward weapons.
    • If they are not limited by high necessary critical hit percentages, then they need to be limited to certain range windows (for example just CQB ranges). Take SMGs and SAs, for example. As classes, they both have very quick optimal TtKs, but they quickly lose effectiveness once they are outside of their optimal ranges. This is due to the principle of damage fall off (which slows down TtK when you are engaging a target that is too far away) and aim assist fall off (which makes it harder to hit a target that is outside of your weapons effective range). SMGs and SAs are solid example for close range weapons, but the principle is the same for long range weapons as well. For example the High-Impact PRs and SRs both have quick TtKs, but they can be limited in their effectiveness at close range by increasing the base zoom magnification, making them feel unwieldy when targets are too close to the user.
  3. Weapons that kill very slowly (0.83s to 1.00s, in general) need to be made useful in comparison to more powerful weapons. This can be done in one or more ways:
    • They can have a very low crit percentage necessary to achieve optimal TtK, which makes them forgiving weapons, and more useful to players who lack the accuracy necessary for high crit-percentage weapons. Take for example the Precision SRs, which kill in an abysmal 1.00s, but only require 50% headshots to hit that time.
    • They can maintain their low but effective TtK over longer range windows. An example would be high-impact ARs, which, although they have a slower TtK and require a high headshot percentage, are capable of being used with optimal TtK from short range all the way up through the beginning of long range, well after other ARs have lost their capabilities.
    • They can have a very fast body shot TtK. This is similar to requiring low crit percentage to achieve optimal TtK, except even more extreme. Players who use these weapons can basically ignore the critical hit spots on a target and simply hose them down with rounds, in the hopes that the player they are focusing on misses a shot, which would then make the body shot TtK of the user's weapon the faster option in many cases. Examples of this include the Rapid-Fire ARs and Adaptive SMGs.
    • Or, they can have the ability to kill lower than normal Resiliency targets with a faster optimal TtK than they have on higher Resiliency targets. Although this is sometimes seen as a problem, most of the listed Lower-Resiliency TtKs (Precision ARs, Adaptive PRs, High-Impact HCs) have been in D1 during certain metas and have not been hit with resistance, so I see no reason why they would be a problem in the current state of D2. So, for example, High-Impact HCs are basically useless with a normal TtK of 1.00s, but they are capable of killing targets at 2 armor or lower in a blazingly fast 0.50s. Of course, these abilities must be balanced by forcing the user to hit a very high percentage of critical hits against the low armor target, otherwise they start to feel like cheap gambling.

Primary Weapons

Sidearms

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Lightweight 360 1.2 0.67 1 crit 4 body 20% 0.83 6 49 39
Adaptive 300 1.2 0.60 1 crit 3 body 25% 0.80 5 60 48
Precision 260 1.2 0.70 1 crit 3 body 25% 0.93 5 61 49
SUROS Rapid-Fire 450 1.2 0.67 6 crit 100% 0.93 8 34 25
Omolon Adaptive 540 1.2 0.67 7 crit 100% 0.90 9 29 23

SMGs

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Adaptive 900 1.3 0.87 4 crit 10 body* 29% 0.93 15 15 14
Lightweight 900 1.3 0.80 12 crit 1 body* 92% 1.00 16 16 13
Precision 600 1.3 0.80 9 crits 100% 1.10 12 23 17

Auto Rifles

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Rapid-Fire 720 1.6 0.83 11 crits 100% 1.17 15 19 14
Adaptive 600 1.6 0.90 7 crits 3 body 70% 1.20 13 22 16
Precision 450 1.6 0.93 4 crits 4 body* 50% 1.20 10 28 22
High-Impact 360 1.6 0.83 6 crits 100% 1.33 9 34 23

Pulse Rifles

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Rapid-Fire 540 1.7 0.80 7 crit 2 body 78% 1.33 13 24 16
Lightweight 450 1.7 0.87 7 crit 1 body 86% 1.33 12 27 18
Adaptive 390 1.7 0.93 5 crit 2 body* 71% 1.40 10 32 21
High-Impact 340 1.8 0.67 6 crit 100% 1.20 9 35 24

Scout Rifles

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Rapid-Fire 260 2.0 0.93 4 crit 1 body 80% 1.40 7 45 30
Lightweight 200 2.0 0.90 3 crit 1 body 75% 1.50 6 57 38
Precision 180 2.0 1.00 2 crit 2 body 50% 1.33 5 61 41
High-Impact 150 2.1 0.80 3 crit 1 body 75% 1.60 5 73 49

Hand Cannons

Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Body TtK Body StK Crit Body
Precision 180 1.4 0.67 3 crit 100% 1.33 5 67 40
Lightweight 150 1.4 0.80 2 crit 1 body 66% 1.20 4 77 51
Adaptive 140 1.4 0.87 1 crit 2 body 33% 1.30 4 86 57
High-Impact 120 1.5 1.00 1 crit 2 body* 33% 1.50 4 95 64

*Kills lower resiliency in fewer shots than listed above

Class Archetype RPM Zoom Optimal TtK Optimal StK Crit % Resiliency Threshold
SMG Adaptive 900 1.3 0.80 13 crit 100% 4
SMG Lightweight 900 1.3 0.73 12 crit 100% 3
AR Precision 450 1.6 0.80 7 crit 100% 5
PR Adaptive 390 1.7 0.60 6 crit 100% 3
HC High-Impact 120 1.5 0.50 2 crit 100% 2

Special Weapons

Special weapons are balanced in much the same way that primary weapons are.

  1. Shotguns kill instantly at close range, but they have a very hard cap on how far out they can damage a target. Precision shotguns are able to move past that cap, because they require a critical hit to kill as opposed to a body shot. Shotguns with a faster RoF require more pellets from a blast to kill, whereas lower RoF shotguns require fewer. Lower RoF shotguns can kill from farther away, but they obviously take far more time to follow up with a second shot.
  2. Snipers are basically snipers. They all kill in one critical hit, and are made less useful at close range by a very high base zoom level. Faster RoF snipers are better for hitting consecutive body shots, while lower RoF snipers are more precise instruments which punish inaccuracy, but do more damage (and thus can kill enemies who have taken damage from allies, or opponents who are in armored-supers).
  3. Fusion rifles I made some minor changes too. I increased the charge rate of close range fusions so that they could be more effective up close, and I decreased the charge rate of high impact fusions so they take longer to shoot, but are lethal at much longer distances than they currently are.
submitted by /u/Mercules904
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Summary of "Go-Fast" update based on player opinions (from what I've seen)

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 11:02 AM PDT

I'm limiting these points to the objective(s) of the update specifically.

The Good

  • Core gameplay - in PvE - feels significantly better with the movement changes, weapon buffs, subclass improvements, and increased ability recharge speeds.
  • General weapon buffs are positively received across the board.
  • General movement buffs to base walking, strafe, and Warlock/Titan jumps are appreciated
  • Sniper Rifles feel significantly better at landing headshots, in addition to Handcannon accuracy buffs (on the ground and in-air).
  • Rumble fulfills some level of chaos that players have wanted.
  • Some are reporting that players quitting has reduced to a noticeable degree in the competitive playlist.
  • The current Nightfall strike-specific weapon has a generally good design model, with good PvP centered perks.

The Bad

  • Players feel as though enemy players escape combat too quickly in PvP; due to the time it takes to kill said player.
  • Power Ammo is too abundant, and is moving the meta more towards Power weapon usage, rather than Primary weapon usage.
  • Rumble spawns are too close to one another, and there isn't enough opportunity for 1v1 engagements to finish.
  • No radar in competitive is still a mixed bag for many players. While players in a team can make due with it, it is a significant disadvantage to solo players.

What Needs Work/Consideration

  • Time To Kill (TTK) should be looked at in upcoming updates to reduce the chances of players escaping 1v1 situations. General player sentiment is to simply lower it overall, or create an optimal TTK that is much lower; with Vigilance Wing being a good standard to look at.
  • Weapons such as Sniper Rifles and Shotguns (maybe Fusion Rifles), would likely be best served in the secondary (energy) slot. Though weapon slot changes are in the works for Fall 2018, the update emphasizes why the listed weapons need to be separated.
  • Rumble is more suited to 5-6 players at most, with possible changes to spawn locations/spawn time being needed as well.
  • Consider increasing the timers on Power Ammo so it isn't so prevalent. Currently, weapons like The Colony and the Legend of Acrius are far too prevalent and abusive in PvP. Note that this does NOT mean both weapons should be nerfed.
  • Players would appreciate a slight sprint speed buff
  • Nightfall Strike Specific loot models could have a more distinct appearance. There's also opportunities for such loot to have a unique feature to them. Assuming Raid/Trials gear gets looked at in the future (to make them more unique), Strike Specific loot should not overshadow them. In the future, it is also worth adding more gear to each strike (such as strike-themed armor).

Summary

This update has significantly improved the core gameplay experience in PvE, and while Nightfall Strike rewards could use a bit of work, its a step in the right direction. PvP still needs significant tweaking, with the most prominent request being changes to TTK. Tying all of this together are continued calls for special weapon (e.g. Sniper Rifles, Shotguns, etc) separation from the Power slot. Generally, the update puts the game on a better path, but more work is definitely needed. Communication with the developers should be more prevalent moving forward, and it would be good to get a general mindset of what the Developers believe the community wants so that everyone has the other sides perspective; which could better improve the game in the long-run.

EDIT Added better clarity to some of the points made.

submitted by /u/Biggy_DX
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[tower thought] It's both strange and refreshing that this update was in response to PvP issues but helped PvE, instead of hurting it.

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 08:52 AM PDT

Bungie, THANK YOU for making Dawnblade a million times better

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 08:43 AM PDT

Before this update, I only grudgingly used Dawnblade. Either for some Solar/Phoenix Dive challenge in Strikes or simply using it out of boredom simply for a change of pace, in spite of its awfulness.

Now it's the fucking bee's knees and I love it.

Attunement of Sky feels amazing right now. Toss grenade, hit with Swift Strike, then soar up into the sky with a new and improved Glide and pinpoint accurate shots from any weapon. Earn both abilities back before you even land. Repeat.

Not to mention that even without Swift Strike active, you're still much harder to hit while airborne thanks to the speed increase, which evens the odds a bit.

Man that's awesome. You can do more ability spam than either of the other subclasses. And since Sunbracers makes the Solar grenade one of the highest DPS abilities against stationary targets (and can easily wreck even mobile targets that don't move fast enough) that can really mean something.

Having an extra sword to throw makes Daybreak's wonkiness easier to bear, as well as the increased speed during Glide. (Burst Glide gives you such insane momentum currently I think it's TOO much and I need to get used to it; I keep sailing past my targets. Gonna need practice, but having that option is fantastic.)

Attunement of Flames is still a bit meh for me since it's only ability is Phoenix Dive and a long lasting Super. But hey at least it's a lot easier to kill like 20 adds before Daybreak runs out.

P.S. Also thank you for allowing Warlocks to keep up with other classes, Christ did Glide suck a fat one before. Now even with Balanced Glide I'm faster than the pre-update Burst Glide.

submitted by /u/Faust_8
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If anything.. I'm under the strong impression that Bungie will avoid these mechanics like the plague. No matter how much we scream.

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 05:43 AM PDT

I want an 8-minute vidoc from all the devs who support these decisions.

We all know Bungie has a strong stance against two things. Lowering the TTK and Switching up the weapon slots. Like someone, within Bungie, with authority is just holding on to that concept and not letting go. Take a hint from WarFrame Dev Steve. You can't cherish ideas. You have to let the community/players decide if it is a good idea. And we told Bungie since October 2017 that we need lower TTK and switch weapons back. What we get. A team over thinking it and trying other methods (Go Fast) instead of just lowering the TTK and switching the weapons back.

It is baffling. I would love an article from Bungie's on their approach/philosophy to TTK in PvP and why the change and bullish/stubborn line in the sand on keeping TTK this high and not switching weapons. I want an 8-minute vidoc from all the devs who support these decisions.

I want to understand two things! Because I don't get it.

  1. You have a winning formula from D1 and you just change it completely. For what reason? Please explain in an 8-minute vidoc from all the devs who support these decisions. You have never explained the developer's philosophy and what you felt it would solve to change so much. We've asked a numerous amount of times here on Reddit. You say "We here you? We are listening?". So answer the hard questions.

  2. Why do you feel now that you have changed that you must stick with it and not change back? I want an 8-minute vidoc from all the devs who support these decisions. We've asked a numerous amount of times here on Reddit. You say "We here you? We are listening?". So answer the hard questions.

I am not saying anything that hasn't been said on Reddit before. This will be added to the enormous pile that has already been submitted from the community via Reddit, Twitter, Twitch, and YouTube.

But I want to see the group of devs in a senior position suck it up and put their face on camera and support these decisions and tell us why this is best for the game. Because after this amount of time of avoiding the changes like the plague we need to know. Why is this the best for the future of Destiny 2? At this rate, you will not get any money out of me for Destiny 3. No matter what you say.

submitted by /u/GameOutLoud
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Remember when complaining about strike loot that a lot of players have asked to obtain shells, sparrows etc more like we did in d1 (instead of just having them randomly pop out of eververse engrams)

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 08:51 AM PDT

Sure three weapons and no armor was disappointing and the weapons themselves were "meh" at best.

But don't confuse the topics here. Having shells, sparrows and shaders that are tied to a specific event you have to overcome instead of just prizes in a lottery is something a lot of us have asked for.

I get that you'd rather have lots more interesting weapon and armor (not that it's currently possible to have interesting armor in d2) but please think a moment before complaining too much about the "trinkets". Collecting those raid sparrows etc was a cool part of d1 and this was a (small) step towards that that unfortunately was overshadowed by the small amount/low quality of weapons introduced.

submitted by /u/Darkoftheabyss
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Meditations should be replays of famous Destiny 2 events. Twilight Gap, the Disaster, Iron Lord's Assault on Siva: and they should Horde Mode.

Posted: 28 Mar 2018 10:23 PM PDT

You step into the past and see the greatest battles Guardians ever fought in and fight to the death as they did.

Each week could cycle Events and modifiers with the rewards being tied to Event relevant gear:

  • Iron Lord Armor and Weapons
  • Shattered Guardian Gear from the moon
  • Gear from the Guardians who fought at Twilight Gap

Team of 6 Guardians face 5 increasingly difficult waves of enemies with a boss at the end.

Score can be based both on kills and team kills. Like you'll earn better rewards the better you perform, but as long as your team scores decently then you'll still get something.

Ikora could narrate the battle and what went wrong or how you did better, etc

I don't know I'm just kinda rambling (7}

EDIT Shout out to /u/RaylonDrakenstar for suggesting the following:

Just to add to the conversation, some copy/paste from a post I made a few months ago. I think a horde mode in the style of what's being discussed today would be a great addition to the end game and much better than a "enter room and kill stuff forever" mode.

Lore/Reasoning:

An Ikora "Super Meditation" (insert better name here). She has us meditate on the success, struggles, and failures of great battles before our time. This adds a little bit more lore into the game as well as some added utility with Ikora. The scenarios I mention here have been fleshed out fairly well in the Grimoire cards of old. Some of the "weird storytimes" in the class quests are about moments in these battles.

Players 4/6/8?:

With the mix of 3, 4, and 6 man fireteams, this is tough to decide. I would say at least 4 so a crucible fireteam can jump into a PvE activity together. The firefights should be hectic, with the team outnumbered. Supers do cause a problem with eventually just being able to chain them depending on the player count. Can't just increase enemy health (bullet sponge) or not drop orbs (makes some perks/gear useless).

Matchmade and Fireteam. Match people together and just let them get wrecked. How about a not so subtle hint towards some featured clans looking for people to join shown when the team fails or quits? Clans should be able to create full teams, let 8 clan members join in (if that is the cap). Maybe two separate teams who can/need to help each other out from separate areas in the scenario (could get reeeaaal salty).

Rewards:

  • One Horde mode armor set but with ornaments based on the scenarios (bring back AoT style ornaments!). Same with weapons? Maybe an exotic for each scenario, or one for all of Horde mode?
  • Emblems and shaders (duh)
  • Clan banner designs, staves, decorations.

I'm not even going to touch the token/how we get these rewards issue…

Competition:

Replayability for the hardcore and clans looking to make a name for themselves. Also gives "normal" folks a metric for improvement.
* Leaderboards
* Scored based on time, deaths, kills, objectives completed, lines held. Think Strike and Challenge of Elders scoring.
* Top dogs are given a shout out on TWAB, like Challenge of Elders back in the day.

Scenarios:

Some background information/lore should be shown before the thing actually starts. Either when forming the fireteam or when loading in. Narration at certain milestones by Ikora/others about the events of the battle, pulling from Grimoire cards, would add a nice touch!

These maps should be somewhat large and have multiple defensive lines to fall back to or reclaim. If your team is ultra badass, you can hold the "starting area" pretty well. If you need to, you can fall back to other areas which are a more defensible position.

Fallen - Battle of Twilight Gap
A battle against a coordinated force of Fallen Houses at the famous Twilight Gap. Fight off Walkers, Skiffs, avoid Ketch bombardments, defend/activate gun emplacements (big guns on D1s Twilight Gap). Maybe even use those guns/other turrets in the fight? Scenario is complete when Shaxx rolls through with the Redjacks/other Guardians and a Ketch is destroyed.

Hive - The Great Disaster (Mare Imbrium)
A brave, but foolish campaign to take Luna back from the Hive. Crota makes his appearance here and the sky burns with green fire. Some objectives could be to stop hive portals from opening and defending other fireteams of Guardians as they evacuate the battle. Scenario complete when Crota makes his appearance. The sky is completely engulfed in green flames. Wizards tear the Light from you/teammates and Crota cutting down you/teammates. Give us a little first-person cutscene. Make us fear the Hive.

Cabal - No great battle that I know of. Another "game" with Emperor Calus on the Leviathan would probably work best but that isn't a "meditation".

Vex - No great battle that I know of. Vex Simulation? Black Garden? Vault of Glass?

submitted by /u/Amphabian
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Go fast? Get supers? Have fun? You can! Mayhem clash is up in D1!

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 09:45 AM PDT

And it is actually fun. Not 0.04% less crappy. Not slightly less bad. Not some interpretation of what we want.

Just fun.

submitted by /u/bungiebetatester
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Bungie, please make PC Titan Skating possible on console too. This is just amazing.

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 04:24 AM PDT

https://clips.twitch.tv/DistinctFurtiveSalamanderTwitchRaid

gif version by Mblim771_Kyle:

https://i.imgur.com/9SdAAAw.gifv

Remember this?

"We believe there are a number of gameplay atoms like this that (Shoulder Charge as a dodge) perform or are used differently than we expected but are thoroughly enjoyed nonetheless. In the future, we want to embrace the state of gameplay atoms like that and balance around it, not against it."

Please do not nerf this on pc. On the contrary, make it a thing on console too. If you have to do speed up a bit more Hunter and Warlock, i'm more than fine with that, but please give this to consoles. Thanks.

Edit: as i said, to not be op something more needed to be done to Warlock and Hunter, but an important detail too is making it difficult to master, as it was in D1. In D1, all 3 jumping habilities were fine, unique and powerfull in their own particular way even if Titan was the fastest in a straight line.

submitted by /u/Sir_AndrewFay
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Bones of Eao

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 12:59 AM PDT

My Hunter desperately needs them back. Please throw us hunters a bone!

submitted by /u/oopiestevie
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Datto has given his thoughts.

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 11:55 AM PDT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19yI_PRkT6c,

Summation is mostly positive. Patch sorta did what it said it was going to do. Also annoyed that sprint speed is locked, would like a dev response. PVP issues with Legend of Acriu/ I mean power ammo. Interestingly enough his opinion on the pvp side is that we need to wait for 6v6 before we can have a real opinion on the team shot meta and ttk changes. There are other issues in the game, but this patch wasn't about those. It did what it said it was going to do.

Worth the watch, Datto is particularly entertaining in this one.

Edit: Positive in regards to the patches goals. He still thinks the overall game needs a lot of work.

submitted by /u/LordSlickRick
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I wouldn't mind if the tower got blown up again and we moved back to the old one.

Posted: 28 Mar 2018 05:24 PM PDT

It's just too big honestly. Or at least move the vendors closer together.

submitted by /u/mynameisfury
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Dear bungie, can me and three other randos please face four other randos.

Posted: 28 Mar 2018 08:38 PM PDT

The constant stacked teams of four are really starting to grind my gears, sincerely a fan.

submitted by /u/christian_g1998
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Whoever came up with the dual primary system at Bungie?

Posted: 29 Mar 2018 12:15 PM PDT

Whoever it is needs to be sent packing. This is the #1 reason why the current sandbox is such a disaster. I'd really like to know if the smart cookie who decided to implement this still thinks its a good idea

submitted by /u/Luke_the_OG
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