Dota 2 - DOTA Summit 8 Day 3 Match Discussions

DOTA Summit 8 Day 3 Match Discussions
DOTA Summit 8 - Group C round 3 - LGD Gaming vs Fnatic
/r/DotA2 is spoiled
Newbee asks for Tencent's apology for their usage of Kpii's photo
Red Silencer Died For This?
The Amazon EEcho - Dota Summit 8
Valve this event is a joke, right?
Valve, Sniper new set is LITERALLY UNPLAYABLE
The olden, dark days of TI4.....
Thanks Summit 8 for bringing in BSJ
Doom recommended by guide is too expensive for starting gold
How Valve completely destroyed Custom Games with the contest
Dota needs a clean up
Don't Talk To Me Or My Son Ever Again!
Slardar scepter upgrade
Goodnight Jimmy
the winter rosh is cool tho
Valve, i think its time to hire an official dota creative director, everything is a shit show.
Dota 2 Blog: "Frostivus Arrives"
Vote with your wallet
Shoutout to all other custom game contest participants!
She hate it when i play. But i got this today.
Anyone feel Dota is going down the same path as TF2?
NA is the strongest region and it's not even close
The FCC just killed Net Neutrality. Why that's bad for esports
Am I the only one who is disappointed by this update?
g l a n c e v a l u e

DOTA Summit 8 Day 3 Match Discussions

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 05:59 AM PST

DOTA Summit 8

Presented by Beyond The Summit

DOTA Summit 8

Presented by Beyond The Summit

Group C round 3 (3 games)

LGD Gaming vs Fnatic

Game 1

Other match discussions: r/dota2 on Discord

submitted by /u/D2TournamentThreads
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/r/DotA2 is spoiled

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 04:49 AM PST

It saddens me to browse this subreddit anymore. All I see on this subreddit are complaints. Everywhere. Every other thread is a "petition to Valve" or an "Open letter to Valve" or a suggestion stating what the majority of reddit (2k players) want. It really does sadden me.

In the old days, Major bugs were the only things posted to this subreddit, and if Valve fixed that bug, the subreddit would be ecstatic about the fix. Nowadays, we have people making threads about how bad the Christmas event is, or even just typos in descriptions. The amount of hate I see towards Valve is unreal.

/r/DotA2 has become spoiled. It started with Valve seeing this subreddit and fixing major bugs. Then they started adding suggestions. Now, if EVERY single thing mentioned on this subreddit is not added, everyone BLOWS up. It's like raising a child and giving him candy one night, when he doesn't usually get candy. Now you start giving him candy every Friday night. Now he expects it. If you stop giving him candy on Friday night, the child is gonna throw a temper tantrum. It's annoying. Quit being a child /r/DotA2

/End complaint of complaining-

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Newbee asks for Tencent's apology for their usage of Kpii's photo

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 08:15 AM PST

Tencent launched a vote yesterday on whether esports can be formal sport or not. Here is how the vote looks like. Imgur Tencent used Uzi (Chinese league player) 's photo with the description "esports can win honor for the country", while Kpii's photo with the description "trash game destroying my youth". The word under the number says "totally obsessed with the game and lose ambition". Tencent has always been known for flaming dota2 aggressively and this move triggered a huge response in Chinese dota2 community. Newbee has asked for Tencent's apology for this. Link for Newbee's claim: weibo

submitted by /u/NozomiPower_
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Red Silencer Died For This?

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 01:36 AM PST

submitted by /u/kradnozd
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The Amazon EEcho - Dota Summit 8

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 04:43 PM PST

submitted by /u/KOTLGuy
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Valve this event is a joke, right?

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 01:50 AM PST

This is sad, the Frostivus game is just garbage and unfun. Honestly, these were the types of games back in WC3 days we downloaded, nobody knew what it was, we played it once then never played again. The coding of these mini games probably took 10 minutes. Meanwhile this masterpiece for example is rotting in the arcade. What a shame...

EDIT: it may have minimal replay value if played with friends but it is still subpar

Furthermore, if we (or Valve, since there was no community vote afaik) keep highlighting and supporting this crap with real cash while the true valuable content gets dumpstered then we shouldn't be suprised that content creators abandon Dota

submitted by /u/feuer_werk
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Valve, Sniper new set is LITERALLY UNPLAYABLE

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 01:14 AM PST

submitted by /u/zeedoto
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The olden, dark days of TI4.....

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 04:15 AM PST

submitted by /u/geodarkross
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Thanks Summit 8 for bringing in BSJ

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 11:42 PM PST

TBH I just wanna thanks the crew of Summit 8 for bringing in BSJ as their caster. Although he may not be a tier 1 player, BSJ does have a lot of insight knowledge on the carry perspective that help the viewers on team drafting and heroes items decision.

P/S: Keep it PMA, keep it BSJ.

submitted by /u/M1zteRy
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Posted: 15 Dec 2017 03:47 AM PST

submitted by /u/Goobala
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How Valve completely destroyed Custom Games with the contest

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 04:10 PM PST

Hey guys, I'd like to take a second to talk from a developer's perspective about how much of an absolute trainwreck this competition has been from start to finish. I'd like to acknowledge that, while there have been concerns about the quality of the winning game, I'd like to focus on the process that got us to this point instead of the game that won.

Let's start from the beginning

September 17, 2017- Valve announces their competition. All of the developers think its going to be great so we all get to work immediately, since 2 months is not alot of time. However, there are huge issues in the rules, like

There is no grading criteria published whatsoever. How are we supposed to know how good our games are? Does art matter alot or is gameplay the only thing we should be focusing on? Do we have to worry about players on the Arcade or is it quality based only? (This mattered a lot for us, our game requires 10 people playing at the same skill level to be extremely enjoyable). How closely do we follow Frostivus existing/new lore?
What does "No third party assets" mean? Does this mean we can't use completely open source code like literally every mod on the workshop does (Lua, JS (the languages you MUST use to build your mod) are third party assets!!!!) (Even the winning entry used third party assets! He let them know and they got permission from the owners to use them even when they were open source, but still this is completely neglectful)
Tons of other issues like not being able to submit contributors or dedicated servers working or there being existing mods given Frostivus tags

We emailed. Over, and over, and over. I personally sent 3 to every Valve address I know and got nothing back ever. These are ESSENTIAL RULE CLARIFICATIONS. There is absolutely no excuse for a professional contest with 30K on the line to not have rule clarifications.

Past that, there's two months of people working hard, with the deadline extension and stuff which I'm going to skip since it's controversial

Now comes the legendary Valve Email that was sent to two of us that I'd like to talk about for a little while.

Past the deadline of November 24th, Valve never locked the mods! So we could still update them and do whatever to them. Considering Valve didn't seem very organized, noone had faith that they took copies of mods on the deadline for judging instead of just downloading them whatever (which they didn't in the end). This was SUPER important, because people were literally still adding content past the deadline! So you created this divide between people who were creating content past the deadline to get an advantage and those who followed the rules. After 17 emails, Valve finally responded a week after the deadline, saying

Regarding your ... question about updates, bugfixes can still be submitted, but are not guaranteed to be included in the review process.

This is probably the worst answer in the history of Valve answers that was ever given.

This was not sent out as an official answer to anyone, only over email to 2 (known) people. This is an incredibily important topic to all modders yet they couldn't even make a solid answer on this.
What is a bug fix? Does "Fixed a bug where the final boss didn't exist" count as a bug fix? Are we going to be disqualified if we submit something that YOU consider isn't a bug fix? Are the people who updated before hand going to be disqualified? What does ANY of this mean?
What does "not guaranteed" mean? Does this mean you're just hapazardly downloading games off of the workshop and playing them as is? This actually introduces RNG to who wins the prize! Two people just fixed crucial bugs to their game, but valve played one before the crucial bug was fixed and one after, so the one afterwards won. How is that remotely fair?

Needless to say, the entire community was livid and up in arms about this, but we heard literally nothing back.

Talking about the selection process for a bit, a few days later Valve sends out this gem of a facebook post https://www.facebook.com/dota2/posts/1707884899276960

This directly states that subscriber count is a factor for judging! What a disaster!

The entire community became this clusterfuck of a race to beg all the big YouTubers to play their games, and everyone kept breaking the bugfix rule too to add new content and whatnot to get active players so it just became an absolute disaster.

The final winner?

The one to rule them all?

Frostivus festival.

No coincidence,

Played by bulldog 3 times and had 2 (3?) separate videos about it to boost player count, when all other mods had 1 at best
#1 on the subscriber counts out of all of the mods that were legal (Feastivus was higher but had copyright issues, some other mods were higher but were just old mods tagged with frostivus)

I don't have to break it down that Valve obviously just grabbed the one with the most players.

Additionally, it broke the rules of third party content (discussed earlier) (Thankfully did not abuse the bugfix loophole too heavily but that loophole was still a huge issue for us)

Regardless of what you think of the mod, consider this- there is no second, third, or whatever place mod. Noone besides this one mod received anything at all from the contest, not even feedback from Valve.

Lastly, Valve doesn't have the guts to come answer up and talk about their judging process or how they felt that all of their competition was

Thank you to all of the contributors who worked hard to help make this contest a resounding success.

I really feel a great sense of pride and accomplishment from this contest.

Custom games are over with this. My diablo 2 in dota 2 project ( from here https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/6uc841/diablo_2_in_dota_2_needs_your_help/ ) is officially cancelled. Alot of other modders are exhausted. It's sad.

Edit: for those who asked, I made this mod http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1158412580

submitted by /u/Arhowk
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Dota needs a clean up

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 06:35 AM PST

We need a cleaning update where we get things changed/fixed suck as

Coaching

Spectator

UI bugs

Demo bugs

Maybe some menu changes for watching tournaments, add some standings for the big tournaments in client

Custom Hero/Item grids

Friends list groups

And many more, feel free to share what small non gameplay things you'd like fixed/improved! (ive missed a lot i cant think of atm)

submitted by /u/xLisbethSalander
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Don't Talk To Me Or My Son Ever Again!

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 11:44 PM PST

submitted by /u/Here_I_Am_What_Now
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Slardar scepter upgrade

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 05:17 AM PST

Units effected by corrosive Haze leave a pool of water for slardar to Sprint through

Edit: i didn't properly imply the pool becomes a trail of water as the enemy moves around.

submitted by /u/Mortotem
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Goodnight Jimmy

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 08:21 PM PST

submitted by /u/Silvainxyts
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the winter rosh is cool tho

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 05:21 AM PST

submitted by /u/hektorathug
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Valve, i think its time to hire an official dota creative director, everything is a shit show.

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 05:49 PM PST

the game is single-handedly staying afloat by the competitive scene and i dont mean money-wise, i am talking about player base and interest in the game. TF2 died because of the same treatment but the diff was its comp scene was meh.

icefrog is a great balance magician but this "in-the-dark" treatment with the community is killing it.

Game needs direction.

submitted by /u/ExDoublez
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Dota 2 Blog: "Frostivus Arrives"

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 02:39 PM PST

submitted by /u/wickedplayer494
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Vote with your wallet

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 01:26 AM PST

My opinion might be unpopular, because I know there're a lot of Valve-fanboys who have a million of excuses that Valve does everything right. Sorry guys, I've an opposed opinion.

Those who support Valve will say that Dota2 is F2P and the company doesn't owe anything. But let's make it clear: this F2P-game brings Valve a huge profits, way much than some studios earn by selling their games.

Let's talk about The International 2017, Dota 2's grand annual tournament, that has been able to break yet another record. Only 25% of Battle Pass/Lvl/Bundle/Treasures sales is prize pool contribution. That means that Valve earned almost $100 000 000 only by selling in-game cosmetics. Well, they had great costs: the prizepool, visa's, accomodation, transfers, lease, etc, but let's imagine it again: $100 000 000 thanks to the Dota 2 community's contributions.

As a result we had let's call it "not the best" organization of the tournament.

Let's move on.

Valve has always had problems with the timings. Well known meme "Valve time" is inadmissable shortcut for a business structure. But seems like Valve HQ's don't give a f... about it simply by breaking most of the dates they trying to set. Despite we're living our lifes in the age of information, Valve can't communicate with it's playerbase. The best thing we can hear from them in a rare blog post is the date that they'll break once again. Do you really think that it takes months to replace the numbers with medals? Well, we got it! A new matchmaking system full of bugs. Oh, I forgot: it's not new: they just replaced numbers with medals without solving any of the game problems: there're still ruiners, smurfs and people who do not know the language of the region in which they play.

The next stop is the holiday event. At some point they forgot about the fact that people like the festive spirit in games, even if it's just getting some free hats during the special events. They didn't care about Diretide, Frostivus, but this year Valve came back to their senses and outsourced a Christmas event to the community. You'll call it the right decision, but let's be honest: Valve fucked up even here. Check the post by one of the custom game developers, and you'll realise: the hardest thing Valve did for this update was creating the blog post and pushing the update. They did literally nothing, they're so freaking lazy and this Frostivus event is a goddamn pittance (no offense to the creator).

We just had a great example of EA's failure with Battlefront 2. That was a great example of people unification dissatisfied with the product that caused EA a huge loss of money. Why shall we tolerate the attitude of the company? I love Dota2 it was a great game, but let's be honest: developers get tired of the game, Dota2 is going down the same way as TF2 did it before, it's dying now while the company behind it is making huge profits. Next time when you'll decide to open a treasure or buy a Battle Pass, think about the game: do you enjoy it's current state? Do you really want to support Valve with your wallet? I would say no.

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Shoutout to all other custom game contest participants!

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 10:57 AM PST

People worked hard for 2 months straight up to the very end of the contest and I think they at least deserve a shoutout, since nobody else other than the winner was mentioned in the Valve blog post.

Feastivus by darklord and co. - a very high quality game taking inspiration from Overcooked. I thought this one had a good shot at winning!

Winterstorm by Avalon studio - a very original and well executed take on survival genre.

The Second Day of Frostivus by Baumi and co. - this was one of my top games. A story-driven co-op adventure in holdout style. Not the most polished game ever, but a fun one!

Snowtown Throwdown by A Bunch Of Pro Guys - I'll admit, I didn't like this one too much gameplay-wise, but this is objectively the best game execution-wise in this contest. The graphical fidelity is off the charts! I thought this one had a good shot as well due to the sheer polish the team put into it.

Frostivus: The Degreeviling by Dota 2 Imba Devs - This game features a lot of cool concepts and a very pretty map. Fight bosses, secure control points, capture greevils for presents, all the good stuff!

and finally, my little creation - It's Greeviling! It's a dota-style game where you can build your own custom greevils from eggs and bonuses you loot from creeps and heroes. Even though it's most likely just another dead custom game I burnt out myself for 2 months on, I'm still glad I made it. I guess.

I didn't list all the games just because there are so many of them, you can find the full list by going here. Let's give to the custom game creators! They put out so much work even though the contest was a mess from the very beginning!

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She hate it when i play. But i got this today.

Posted: 15 Dec 2017 04:38 AM PST

submitted by /u/volderza
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Anyone feel Dota is going down the same path as TF2?

Posted: 14 Dec 2017 05:25 PM PST